Thursday, March 29, 2012

Why Does The Department Of Homeland Security Need 450 Million Hollow Point Bullets?

Michael Snyder, Contributor
Activist Post

Somebody out there has decided that the Department of Homeland Security needs a whole lot of ammunition.  Recently it was announced that ATK was awarded a contract to provide up to 450 million hollow point bullets to the Department of Homeland Security over the next five years.

Is it just me, or does that sound incredibly excessive?  What in the world is the DHS going to do with 450 million rounds?  What possible event would ever require that much ammunition?

 If the United States was ever invaded, it would be the job of the U.S. military to defend the country, so that can't be it.  So what are all of those bullets for?  Who does the Department of Homeland Security plan to be shooting at?  According to the U.S. Census, there are only about 311 million people living in the entire country.  So why does the Department of Homeland Security need 450 million rounds of ammunition?  Either this is an incredible waste or there is something that the Department of Homeland Security is not telling us.

I could understand if the U.S. military was ordering ammunition in this quantity.  When you fight wars you can go through ammunition very rapidly.

But the Department of Homeland Security is only supposed to be shooting at people very rarely. It simply does not make sense that they would need so much ammunition.

The following is an excerpt from the official press release about this deal between ATK and the Department of Homeland Security....
ATK announced that it is being awarded an Indefinite Delivery/Indefinite Quantity (IDIQ) agreement from the Department of Homeland Security, U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (DHS, ICE) for .40 caliber ammunition. This contract features a base of 12 months, includes four option years, and will have a maximum volume of 450 million rounds.
ATK was the incumbent and won the contract with its HST bullet, which has proven itself in the field. The special hollow point effectively passes through a variety of barriers and holds its jacket in the toughest conditions. HST is engineered for 100-percent weight retention, limits collateral damage, and avoids over-penetration.
'We are proud to extend our track record as the prime supplier of .40 caliber duty ammunition for DHS, ICE,' said Ron Johnson, President of ATK's Security and Sporting group.
But this is not the only kind of ammo that the DHS is placing an order for.

Business Insider is also reporting that the Department of Homeland Security is seeking to buy 175 million rifle ammunition rounds....
We've also learned that the Department has an open bid for a stockpile of rifle ammo. Listed on the federal business opportunities network, they're looking for up to 175 million rounds of .233 caliber ammo to be exact. The 223 is almost exactly the same round used by NATO forces, the 5.56 x 45mm.
This all comes at a time when gun sales are absolutely going through the roof in the United States. Gun manufacturer Sturm, Ruger & Co. recently announced that it would be suspending new orders until May because it received orders for more than one million guns during the months of January and February.

The following announcement about this suspension of sales comes from their official website....
  • The Company's Retailer Programs that were offered from January 1, 2012 through February 29, 2012 were very successful and generated significant orders from retailers to independent wholesale distributors for Ruger firearms.
  • Year-to-date, the independent wholesale distributors placed orders with the Company for more than one million Ruger firearms.
  • Despite the Company's continuing successful efforts to increase production rates, the incoming order rate exceeds our capacity to rapidly fulfill these orders. Consequently, the Company has temporarily suspended the acceptance of new orders.
  • The Company expects to resume the normal acceptance of orders by the end of May 2012.
Since Barack Obama first took office, gun sales in America have risen to extraordinary levels. Overall, more than 10 million guns were sold in the United States during 2011.

And gun sales have continued to rise at a brisk pace in 2012.  The following was recently posted on Yahoo News....
The NSSF said that 920,840 instant criminal background checks were made in January alone, a gain of 17.3% over the same month in 2011. This now makes it the 20th consecutive month of increases. While using the number of background checks is a good measurement of sales, it doesn't paint the whole picture as some checks are used for the purchases of multiple firearms. Also, some private transfers and sales from gun shows are exempt, making the actual number of guns sold higher.
According to Gallup, 41 percent of all Americans said that they owned a gun in 2010.  But when that question was asked again in 2011, that number had risen to 47 percent.

Clearly, a lot of Americans are feeling the need to arm themselves.

Unfortunately, they may find themselves short on ammunition for those guns considering how much ammo the government is buying up.

So what is causing everyone to buy so many guns?

Well, without a doubt we are likely to see a rise in crime as the U.S. economy continues to crumble.  People want to be able to protect themselves and their families when everything falls apart.  In fact, we are already starting to see some really violent home invasions in many parts of the nation.  Many in the prepper movement are deeply concerned about the direction this country is headed and they want to be prepared for whatever happens.

Of course the rising gang problem in America is a major concern too.  According to the FBI there are now 1.4 million gang members living in the United States, and that number has increased by 40 percent since 2009.  Many urban communities have essentially been taken over by these gangs, and many of these gangs are definitely not shy about using violence.  Average Americans that live in these communities want to be able to have a fighting chance against these gangs.

But that doesn't explain why the DHS needs so much ammunition.  Yes, our world is becoming increasingly unstable, but under what conditions does the DHS ever anticipate firing off 450 million rounds?

Something does not add up.  If anyone has a possible explanation for why the DHS would need 450 million rounds of ammunition, please post a comment and share your thoughts with us below....

This article first appeared here at the American Dream.  Michael Snyder is a writer, speaker and activist who writes and edits his own blogs The American Dream and Economic Collapse Blog. Follow him on Twitter here.


This article may be re-posted in full with attribution.


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Anonymous said...

I think it may simply be to circumvent private individuals from attaining them. It is a means of enforcing an anti-gun agenda without having to use force or go through the legal process to do so.

Anonymous said...

Does that 450 million account for shooting qualifications? In the military, you go through quite a lot of rounds just zeroing in your weapon. While those are for handguns, it's possible they're accounting some of that, at least, as target practice. Either that, or they're planning something in the next 5 years that may involve mass murder.

biscuits007 said...

Ewww, ewww, I know I know. It's so Homeland Security can kill each and every Amerikan, twice.

Ray Barnes said...

Global food surpluses are at an all time low. Meanwhile global warming and changing weather patterns can be counted on to disrupt crops on a major scale. We've just poisoned the Gulf, a major source of food, and we are yet to see what effect the growing oceanic dead zones and radiation contamination of the Pacific due to the Fukashima disaster will have on fishing. It's not hard to predict mass starvation. In the event of an uprising in the US the Military cannot be depended on to fire on our own citizens, so we can expect the DHS to be called upon to execute mass roundups and battling insurgents. There is no other adversary those rounds can be used on. The irony of course is that we paid for each and every one of those bullets with our tax money.

Anonymous said...

"The 223 is almost exactly the same round used by NATO forces, the 5.56 x 45mm."

They're the same thing for all intents and purposes. They're the caliber of the M4 family of weapons.

Netzblockierer said...

I don't know, but it somehow souds quite crazy what I'm going to guess:

Regarding the violent tries to crackdown peaceful protests, the harsher this continues, the more the risk rises that somebody doing the wrong thing in the wrong time. Maybe a shooting?

When this happens, it will lead soon into a new US civil war...

However, even 450m rounds seem to be too much... According to the fact that the military has to do this shit!

Possibly, we have to fear about the risk of democides. Or why does the FEMA need 250k coffins?

Sounds conspiratve, doesn't it? But we know that US organizations plan in long terms... Or why did CNN asked shortly after 9/11 for embedded journalists in anti-war-countries like Germany for spreading pro-Iraq-invasion - propaganda?

Call this however you like, but history tells us, that most people didn't hide their ideas.

Hitler wrote his hatebook during imprisonment in the year 1925
1933, he became councellor,
1939 he started war, and
1942 he officially legitimated genocide.

Are we really unknowing, blind or do we refuse to learn?

''It's impossible to make peace while preparing for a war'' - Albert Einstein

-MikeD> said...

I'm hoping the DHS is moving to a new handgun or special training across all agencies and this ammo is for live fire training. The DHS has 180,000 employees +30,000 or so contractors, that's 210,000 so we get 21.4 rounds for each employee. They are not going to arm every employee. Lets say they only arm 1/3 of all employees 69,300. That's 652 bullets each. I can't find anywhere reliable on the net on how many DHS people are already armed. A HUGE new deployment of side arms, training and a lot of target practice, I mean A LOT of target practice. 652 hollow points for each of the 69,300 trainees is not out of the question. Staying sharp at the range I go through 650 rounds or more in a year. But not hollow points, they are way two expensive for target practice. It's possible the government is going to train all those morons I see packing at the airport and arm a bunch more. I would feel a bit safer if I knew DHS employees had a lot more firearms training. But I doubt it, and assume it's for a far more nefarious purpose.

Anonymous said...

It's because they're for us. Don't kid yourself.

Anonymous said...

Not to worry. A quick look at businessweek (great resource) shows ATK is Alliant Techsystems. Its board has members from Durango Group, Donaldson Corp. Pension Arm, BAE, JF Lehman & Co., Royal dutch Shell and Xerium Tech. Inc..

It's just the boyz stealing some more taxes, taking a bit more of our economy, and moving some of the profits around... Oh, LEGALLY of course. I don't mean to imply anything.

Anonymous said...

In modern warfare it takes a lot of bullets to kill someone. In this country there might be a million or more armed and very angry citizens with guns to shot at. I learned a couple of weeks ago that our new municipal bld. here in little old Lebanon Ky. (pop 8,000) has been hardened with blast proof walls and bullet proof windows! There is a saying in Spain that there are only 7 meals between civil society and anarchy.



Anonymous said...

Pretty expensive rounds to use for target practice, but since when has the government tried to save taxpayer money?

I've seen figures that the US military uses 250,000 rounds per kill in Afghanistan, so maybe DHS is only planing on killing 1800 Americans. Since they're probably even worse shots than the military we may not even notice over all the background daily shooting.

Anonymous said...

@ Netzblockierer - Have you ever actually read Hitler's "hate book"?

It's actually quite valuable at explaining many facets of the Bolshevik propaganda system that is still used today, though in the case of Mein Kampf most refer to it as outlining the Nazi propaganda system despite it not existing for a long time after the book was written.

Certainly the Nazi's made use of some of the systems but how could they have brainwashed all those Germans when practically every German home had a copy of his "hate book" explaining the propaganda systems being used against them?

And why did the U.S Federal Reserve pump over 30 billion dollars into Nazi Germany to build it up before the war?

More importantly why did the U.S Fed Reserve fund Hitler and his anti-Bolshevik National Socialists when they also funded/backed the Bolshevik Revolution in 1917?

Was Hitler just a patsy used to provide the 'Problem' part of the old 'Problem - Reaction - Solution' bit to re-form Europe and much of the world as desired?

Also, could you please cite a single document or speech in which Hitler ever supported unnecessary violence or 'officially legitimized genocide'.

I'm pretty sure the official story still says he initiated the mass murders of up to 11 million people by playing 'Telephone'.

I think there was one document referring to a 'final solution' that often gets cited as evidence, though since the only name on the document of any significance is a CHEF(a cook) it's hard to take that document seriously.

Seriously, a lowly cook was the highest authority in instituting a policy of mass-murder?

Chef's always cook up mass-murder plans here too...

I completely disagree with the guy's fascist and racial philosophies but in 25 years I have yet to see a single document or hear a single speech or comment from Hitler that supports unprovoked violence of any kind, let alone mass-murder.

If the mass-murders happened all indications are that it was a "rogue" operation being carried out by those below Hitler without his knowledge.

Though how the 4.5 million Jews in Nazi occupied Europe multiplied into 7.5 million so that 6 million could be murdered(with approx 1.5 million survivors) during a few years of facing imprisonment and genocide is hard to figure out.

Regardless it is important to understand that the most dangerous thing to humankind has never been 'evil tyrants' - they tend to kill each other off pretty young and rarely become true large scale public threats - but the worst offenders have always been misguided idealists with a vision for the 'greater good'.

Hitler really truly believed in a 'greater good' and a world of peace and harmony, as all those who fell in line behind him did as well.

Even good people can do horrible things when they honestly believe it is for the 'greater good'.

Even Americans and Canadians had no problem rounding up their perceived enemies and dumping them in internment camps(some better, some worse than German equivalents) during the war and treating them in very racist manners in general.

And yeah, yeah I hear the whining all the time "that was not the same!" - but yeah, it was - it was the exact same mind-set the Germans had rounding up the Jews and anyone else they perceived as "enemies".

And internment of civilians is considered genocide whether your intentions were good or not, and that applies to the Nazi's and American's, Canadian's, Aussie's, Brit's and everyone else.

There are no exceptions because we think we are the 'good guys' - the 'bad guys' think they are the 'good guys' who have an exception too usually.

If people finally realized there are NO EXCEPTIONS then maybe we could finally have real peace in this world.

Anonymous said...

DHS does not include DOD which is what the military would fall under. So the DHS acquisition of ammo is a bit perplexing.

apeman2502 said...

Pork for the Carlyle friends.

Anonymous said...

Actually, this is only 1 company providing ammunition over a long period of time, there are many other companies that make ammo that will be available to the public

Hollow points are actually banned for use in war, they are made to kill animals or people, they expand on contact, tearing up the insides of w/e they come in contact with.. They're more expensive than full metal jacket ammo (which is better for things like target practice/training imo)..

David_H said...

We have to take into account that the DHS umbrellas other agencies such as the border patrol and coast guard. I wouldn't look to far into this. Sounds like business as usual.

Anonymous said...

@ David_H - 450 million pistol rounds of hollow point ammo is likely not just business as usual.

And if it is then it really is a very, very sad statement to the current state of the U.S.A.

Anonymous said...

Their real goal is to commit suicide 10 fold.

Anonymous said...

Get ready everybody This thing is actually happening. Get out of the US by September 30th or be heavily armed and create a commune of like minded people. Then if you can withstand the initial wave get working on your food production. There should be plenty of vacant land following the round up and slaughter. Get used to vegetables and nuts as your staple diet and learn how to generate water. Its gonna be rough if you get this far and you still have your kids to protect and educate. GOOD luck to you all. Dan -Australia.

Anonymous said...

They are planning on sending them to the Mexican Drug Cartels or using them on American Citizens.

Anonymous said...

Why Does The Department Of Homeland Security Need 450 Million Hollow Point Bullets?

My gut reaction is to ask if they want them to kill themselves with but I know we ain't that lucky. Most likely, each one of those bullets has the name of an American citizen engraved in it. With the names of those of us who comment on blogs like these being on top.

Anonymous said...

Let's all look at one really old common explanation: Who owns shares in this company? What links are there between the CEO or other influential members of the company and members of the US Government or Department of Homeland Security? I think you'll find that there's either a conflict of interest here in relation to the ownership of shares or a deal between friends - nothing more, nothing less...

Anonymous said...

Hitler was up to a lot more than you think...even here in the us.

Robert said...

where there is smoke there is a fire...

Anonymous said...

Have you all forgotten that Obama said he wanted a private force,and that immediately after his inauguration there were pictures of his supporters in uniform, displaying their prowess.

This purchase of rounds must follow the purchase of the guns to shoot them.

Where is our Congress in all this?

Have you seen the news clips of the Head of the Black Panthers threatening to burn Detroit if the State of Michigan took the city over as that city careens to its ultimate financial destruction on top of its physical destruction?

No wonder other Americans are buying guns!

Anonymous said...

two words. double tap. now 225 million less pesky americans for the Khazar Rothschilds to manage.

apeman2502 said...

Hollow points leave a mess and splatter on impact, sending pieces randomly into the target. Guaranteed expensive surgery or death.

Anonymous said...

I hear all this business about ammo
being hard to find but I'm seeing
price reductions for popular rounds.
I just bought 2,000 rds of 5.56 NATO,
5,000 rds of 9X17 Lugar and 10,000
rds of .22LR over the counter!! Next
month the budget calls for 1000 rds
of 12 Ga 00. What shortage?

Anonymous said...

I think the Government [money power] are trying to prevent the break up of the states and they envisage a whole lot of the kind of stuff that happened in those Middle East countries where it looked like people power was mainly responsible for a lot of fast and successful
'revolutions'.They will have noted
increased gun sales and Internet

Anonymous said...

450 million is not enough ammunition to win a civil war... Especially in .40 cal. Research the amount of ammunition the US was producing at the height of WWII...this is a training and service allotment order. The us army has literally billions of rounds of ammo in stockpile. Besides look on the brightside most of our jobs suck so a few months sorting thingsbout wIth a rogueb DHS would be a hoot...

Anonymous said...

Hollow Points are illegal for military armament.

Anonymous said...

The bullets are for paper targets. DHS has ICE special agents, ERO deportation agents, customs and border protection inspectors, border patrol, secret service, coast guard, federal protective service, federal air marshals and oig (office of inspector general) the top of my head...are all armed. Most qualify once a quarter (4 times a year). Not sure about coast guard, but basically all the "cop" positions would qualify once a quarter. Some of these people are on special response teams (sort of like SWAT) and in addition to .40 caliber pistols, they have M4 rifles (.223) and shotguns assigned to them. What I'm getting at is that DHS goes through a crap load of ammo. With that amount of ammunition use, DHS tries to get into these contracts to have a steady and reliable supply. ATK is the parent company of Federal Premium. DHS has already been using Federal Premium ammunition. The rest of that mambo jumbo about penetrating this and that, blah blah, special bullets, I have no idea what it means. It's useless dribble. Basically we're talking jacketed hollow point (lead) bullets in the .40 caliber. Pretty standard crap for Law Enforcement use. So my long winded point here is......this SOUNDS like a cool story, but it is mind numbingly routine. Nothing to see here people....move right alone. No, DHS is not planning to "kill America". And FEMA can't organize hurricane don't go to crazy with the "FEMA Camps" business.

preacher said...

More Gun Companies On Long Term Backorder

Penny Pincher Personal Finance said...

FMJ ammo is generally cheaper than hollow-point (although it depends on the caliber). If they were just for target practice they'd probably be FMJ. Hollow point is specifically for killing/stopping power. The bullet expands to a flat thing about the size of a quarter, and does more internal damage. FMJ can also kill, but it takes more rounds cause the holes are smaller.

Kel said...

They can't outlaw ammo, so buying them in this quantity will drive the price of it through the roof, making ammo much more expensive for the average American.

Apolitical Blues said...

Millions of rounds of hollow point aren't as concerning as the purchase of bullet proof booths for DHS checkpoint inspections. When taken together, they indicate the uses of the ammo are not intended for target practice. If this purchase, together with the 200,000,000 rounds of .40 cal. hollow point from Winchester in 2009 aren't enough to convince you our government does not have good intentions, pay more attention!

Anonymous said...

Here's what you should really be worried about -


It takes only one quarter pound of salt consumed at one sitting to KILL YOU. Just in the Illinois stockpiles ALONE, they will have enough salt to KILL EVERY AMERICAN TWELVE TIMES OVER.

Potassium Chloride, another SALT, is used by the GOVERNMENT to EXECUTE criminals.

These stockpiles are located near POPULATION CENTERS so it can be ADMINISTERED QUICKLY WHEN NEEDED.

Salt is also used as a preservative, in order to keep FLESH FROM ROTTING. Is the government planning for a massive civil unrest, so large they can't BURY THE BODIES FAST ENOUGH?

Mines are working 24/7 to meet the demand!!!

Why are the state and local governments COORDINATING stockpiling all this salt? Are they hiding FEDERAL GOVERNMENT INVOLVEMENT?



it's road salt...

Get a life.... ;^D

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